coaching episode #1: navigating the transition to home life after treatment

Host: Brenda Zane, brenda@brendazane.com
Instagram: @the.stream.community

Guest: Casie

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Transcript:

Speakers: Brenda Zane, Casie

Brenda  01:49

Today, you are going to get to listen in on a coaching session I had with one of our members in the stream. I'll be sharing these coaching episodes each month, just as a way to let you drop in and hear what other parents are struggling with. And hopefully find some nuggets of insight, or find things that you might want to try in your own family. Today, I have Casey with me, she has a 19-year-old son who is home after a pretty lengthy period in wilderness therapy, residential treatment and sober living, you'll get to hear an unfiltered conversation about what kinds of issues her family is dealing with, what her fears are, and how she starts to uncover some important insights about herself and some of the things that she wants to work on. I apologize in advance for the slightly off audio on this episode. I got myself a new microphone, and I'm still working out the kinks. So thank you for bearing with me. I really appreciate that. And I appreciate Casey's vulnerability, and her willingness to let me record our session. So let's get into it.

Brenda  03:02

Welcome, Casey, I am really glad to have you here today. This is a bit like I told you, it's a little bit of an experimentation in coaching. And the great thing for me is that you're also a coach. So I'm working with somebody who has a lot of skills, but I don't know, if you find this. I find it's like tickling yourself is really hard to do. Even if you're a trained coach, it's really hard to still practice those things sometimes in coach yourself.

Casie  03:30

Absolutely. It's easier to coach someone than to be in the moment and going, Oh, my gosh, wait a minute. What do I do? I'm blanking. I can see the page. I can see, you know, because both of us use the 20 Minute guide for a lot of stuff. I don't know if everybody knows about that on the podcast, but yeah, and you completely go like, yes, in that moment.

Brenda  03:59

Yes. Which is, I think just a note to anybody out there. Even if you are a therapist, and I know in our community in the stream, we have quite a few therapists and counselors, so very qualified, licensed mental health people. But I think that's just a good reminder that you don't have to do it by yourself. But even if you're trained, you don't have to do it by yourself. And so that's one of the reasons I'm excited to do these sessions is to allow people to really kind of receive because, like you, you give so much with so much volunteer work with working with parents in our community, that you probably don't spend a lot of time on the receiving end. And so these sessions are meant for you to be the one on the receiving end. Which is sometimes hard to do, but we are going to we're going to try it out. Are you ready?

Casie  04:58

I'm so ready. Good.

Brenda  05:03

Well, why don't we just start out, I know you a little bit from being in the community. And just if you're listening these sessions, these coaching sessions are available for anybody in the stream community to request a coaching episode, which is really just a coaching session that gets recorded. So if that's interesting to you, that is available at the stream community.com. But why don't you just start out and give us a little snapshot of what your family looks like right now, just so we have to have some context for what you're dealing with and what you're working within.

Casie  05:36

Okay, so I have three children, my 21-year-old is finally out of the house and living on her own and go into Fordham, my youngest is also in college at Savannah College of Art Design. And my middle one who's been the one who has struggled with substance use for the last four years, is after a three and some change journey of being in a wilderness and therapeutic boarding school, transitional living, sober living, trying life on his own, not really succeeding, and he's helped me and how is it?

Brenda  06:19

So you've been through a lot because of somebody is to the point where you've had your child in if you've given them the gift of wilderness and, and all of that residential. You've been through a lot. So you're a seasoned, a well-seasoned parent. So he's 19. He's living at home, and are you married? You have dogs? Are you working? Like what's life look like?

Casie  06:44

So I'm married. My husband is a carpenter, has his own business. I have two cats. Unfortunately, my oldest has trained them to Bay. So now that she's gone, she's thanks a lot.

Brenda  06:59

And I know you do quite a bit of volunteer work with parents. That's how we ended up meeting each other. So you got a busy, you've got a lot going on. In other words, you've got a lot. Yes, I do. Alright, so that's kind of what life looks like. And what do you like to do for fun,

Casie  07:21

walk, walk outside, enjoy the beautiful weather. My biggest self care thing throughout this whole journey has been, we have a spa outside. And I will just go out there with a little kombucha and sit in the spa doesn't matter if it's night or day and just enjoy being in nature. So that's like my, my big go to and my current private thing. Now everybody knows this. I'm watching the Big Bang Theory for my laughs

Brenda  07:54

It's old, isn't it? Isn't that an older show? Yes, it is. Nice. Okay, so you, you recognize that you need some self care, you found some stuff that works for you, which is really awesome. So what do you think, when you kind of think about your world? What's going on right now and your son who's at home? If you had to kind of put the problem in a nutshell, or in one sentence, what would you say is the biggest thing that you're working on right now that that problem?

Casie  08:25

I would say it's having him fit back in the family. Tell me more about that. Because he has been gone for so long. And we had, you know, parent weekends and trips to see each other, but having him in the household, and the house where everything, you know, really went down hill has been different. And it's not just us navigating him being part of a family. It's him navigating it as well. And so he doesn't always follow instructions because he's very used to like transitional living like just just saying, hey, guys are going out for something to eat and walking out getting something to eat. So there's been situations where he's come home and it's dinnertime and he has like a little container of he picked up and he's ready to eat it. They were like, hey, you know, other people here. So navigating that

Brenda  09:37

fitting back into the family, so when he's not fitting back in the family, what tells you that or what's going on that makes it uncomfortable? Like what's what are the signals? This isn't really working for us for is it? Is it mainly you or is your husband feeling the same way as well?

Casie  09:55

Oh, no, both of us feel it will ask him to do something Let's say mowing the lawn. And he doesn't know how to start the mower. Well, instead of asking someone how to start them over, he'll just look it up and figure it out. And his figuring out, things are not always the correct way. So, you know, things can get damaged. Duh, that's a problem. Because he's he, it's a it's like this barrier for him of I don't know, if it's shame. I don't know what's going on. Like, I need to know how to do this, because I've been doing it for so long. But turning to us to clarify, instead of doing it on his own seems to be a struggle like you can you can see that struggle in him. And then of course, we get annoyed or trying to stay in that space of now being in a way, because we're like, couldn't you just asked if you could do it that way, instead of just pretending you knew what you were doing?

Brenda  11:03

So it sounds like there's tension around him not necessarily asking for help. From you, where else is there tension?

Casie  11:16

Well, there's he's bought a car while he's here. And he driven it very fast, got pulled over a lot that he did lie about, but I figured it out. I said to him, what's going on? Something's not right. So he gets a very kind of weird start to act. I don't know if anybody else experiences surfy experienced this with your son, like, you know, instantly, you don't know what it is that they're lying about. But there's something they're lying about. And he loves his new little mini, and he was driving it without a license plate because it fell off. And now he has it with just one bolt on so so that part of trying to also stay in my lane and not like, fix it. Because he doesn't, also doesn't want you to fix it is hard. That's one part and then getting him to trust that we're not going to be mad that he drove too fast and got a warning. I think that's another piece to him being part of the family. You know, it was not a great situation here in the beginning. And so he's still navigating if it's okay to tell us the truth, which is sad.

Brenda  12:36

Yeah, yeah. But I think that's really common. So. So he's engaging in some behavior that is risky, and may feel like old behavior that you saw in the past, which, I'm guessing might cause some anxiety in you because you've traveled that road before, you know where that went. And then he's still having some, there's some trust uncomfortableness to say, I don't know if I can share this with my mom, dad. Because in the past, maybe their response either wasn't helpful, or I ended up getting sent to wilderness therapy or whatever. Like in his mind, he's probably thinking like, Ah, I don't know what's gonna happen if I share this information. Okay, so it does sound like there's quite a bit of attention there. Which is so common, I think this is a great, I'm really glad that we're having this conversation, because this is one that I get questioned about a lot, which is that time when they come home, and how do you start to relive because you've got a kid who's now had a lot of therapy, a lot of different modalities of therapy. They've had some independence. And they're learning and they're developing. And now they're plopped right back into the same environment that they were in with you before. And it's like, Whoa, this is really hard. Yeah. And to add to that, he's 19, which makes the relationship a voluntary one at this point, right. So he can leave if he wants. Or you could ask him to leave if you wanted. So there's a lot of dynamics going on there, which is super common. What are you the most afraid of,

Casie  14:29

out of all of the things that I shared? Really, it's the car and knowing that I can't control him because he's 19. And it is a little mini and he is driving 100 miles an hour. And if he crashes, he could die. And it doesn't substance use, which is amazing. I don't know if I should share this but substance use isn't even My my brain about it because he's really doing so well with that, that part. He's being very honest. But he has a really hard time with that freedom of the car is big. It's huge. And I can't control how fast he drives that I have. I know I have to let it go, friend. I know I do.

Brenda  15:23

Yeah, but you're worried about his safety. And the safety of other people that are on the road, obviously, it sounds like he may be a thrill seeker, which is very, very common in our boys, especially. They, they love that so. So that's sort of a, a close, a near term fear, right? Like I'm afraid today when he gets in the car, he's gonna go crash, what are you most afraid of when you think long term or sort of big picture, if you want to like a 50,000 foot level

Casie  16:02

he has relapsed a couple times already. But they have not been they've been a I'm gonna say a salt fall. And my son has had in our lifetime with this four super hard falls ending up in the hospital. And I worry about that part. I working on myself getting coaching, you know, coaching other people, because I find that talking to other people is super helpful just to have someone else who understands when you're saying this, but know that there's always that possibility of him not recovering from something bad like that. Yeah. Oh, yeah.

Brenda  16:54

That's scary. Scary for a mom? And a dad? Yeah, Mom, it's, it's very scary, because he's your baby.

Casie  17:07

Yeah, he is my baby.

Brenda  17:12

What are his best qualities?

Casie  17:15

He is kind. He is the most affectionate when he was gone. My other two are not as huggy hug. oriented as he is. And he always comes in and hugs me when he gets in the door. And he is willing to sit down and hear what's going on with me. It's not just about him. And he's gonna cry. Oh, and that's just I mean, it's beautiful.

Brenda  17:52

That is that is he sounds like he's very insightful. To me. Yeah. If he can be in tune with you, especially when he's got a lot going on. Right? When you think about what he's been through in the past few years, to be able to still be kind, and to hug your mom, and to care about what's going on in other people's lives shows that he's really got some level of awareness and insightfulness to him. Even beyond his 19 years, it sounds like Oh, yeah. 40-year-olds.

Casie  18:38

It's true. Yeah.

Brenda  18:40

Yeah. Yeah. Well, he sounds really special. I think it's really important to remember those things, because it gets so easy to see what we're afraid of see what they're doing wrong. See what where they're slipping. And, you know, we talked about this in coaching with the partnership, that positive reinforcement and just really taking the time to look at what's going right, because there's so much going right, that doesn't negate the things that are still scary, that doesn't negate the fact that he's, you know, doing some risky things. But it can help sort of counterbalance that sometimes to say, You know what, this kid is really smart. He's really, really smart. And I wonder how you being a coach, you might do this more than the average Joe, but how often do you tell him that? Oh, actually,

Casie  19:38

you're absolutely right. And maybe probably tell him more than I tell him that, you know, and I try to be very specific. So I'm not just saying I'm proud of you, you know, I try to say I hope you're proud of yourself. Like I have all those things. You know, they're in there that I've learned But I do I try to, you know, take the garbage out. It's not just that he's taking the garbage out. Hey, buddy, thank you for taking the garbage out, you know, just noticing that he didn't fight about it. He didn't argue it was just like, oh, yeah, okay, got it?

Brenda  20:19

Yeah, well, the, what I hear is that you guys have great communication, that it's not a situation where he is shut down, you are shut down, there's that tension because nobody's talking. Or if they are talking, it's a lot of yelling. So that's such a positive thing to hang on to. And obviously, you know, when we're doing coaching like this, you can't, you can't solve everything. And we don't try to, because it's kind of like speed coaching a little bit. But I wonder what, if you look kind of at the next six months? What would a win look like for you, in the next six months if something could shift? And, and we did this again, and maybe we will, maybe that's something we're right. But if I was to call you up in six months, and say, Hey, Casey, like I just wanted to check in and in, see how you guys are doing what would feel like a wind in about six months?

Casie  21:24

I think that it would be he has more of a sense of purpose for himself. I mean, I've gained through my own recovery, a lot of sense of purpose, and a lot of but I'm also, you know, 52. So we'll difference in ages. And I know, I'm not asking him to know what he's gonna do for the rest of his life. But I mean, I don't want to say that I would like him to go to college, but that little part of me wants him to go to college. That would be the way I'm like thinking my way through this. And if besides him working, if he started maybe just taking a class or two at a community college and not being afraid of school anymore. Because I think that's, that's kind of how that path got started. There were some negative things that happened at school before he started using, I think that would be a huge win Marquise college all the time. But

Brenda  22:34

so yeah, I'm gonna rewind and ask, what would it what would a win look like for you?

Casie  22:43

Ah, good question. I see I did it. I know that I would like it myself, that would look like for you, because

Brenda  22:51

all of those things are amazing that you're not in control of a single one of them. And so what are you in control of? That would look like a when

Casie  23:02

I am starting my own business. So that would be successful, and would touch a lot of lives. And, like, I just love what you're doing. Being able to touch just one more life for one more parent to feel like we do together not alone,

Brenda  23:28

that you're starting your business and you're thriving in that what else are you doing differently than you're doing today? That would signal things are better.

Casie  23:38

I'm in a peaceful place. I'm a lot more peaceful than I ever was. But I'm really in a place where I know that my kids their pasts are their paths.

And this is one of my favorite lines is keeping the worry in the sidecar. Maybe I'll actually take the worry because now the worries off the hit my worry hands are off the wheel. They're in the sidecar. And my big win would be that the worry wouldn't even be in the sidecar anymore.

Brenda  24:18

Awesome. Awesome. That's amazing. So you're thriving in your business. You feel peaceful? What brings you peace?

Casie  24:30

Health care is a huge bit. Being with friends. Working on myself. I think this is probably normal for a lot of people working on my marriage.

Brenda  24:44

So those are great things. And I wonder how you have time to do those and be so connected and worried about him at the same time? I can't. Right? Yeah. Yeah. So What? What would happen? If he went to go do something and you knew there were probably two or three things that might go haywire in that particular situation. And if you instead went to one of these things that you just listed self-care, getting together with friends, working on yourself working on your marriage working on your business, what would that? What would that feel like?

Casie  25:30

Power, my power, my, my control, I can't control what's going on around me. But I can help myself to stay calmer. When life is out of control on the outside. I'm on a much healthier person with that.

Brenda  25:56

What do you think would? What do you think his response would be if he was leaving out the door and I kind of think about in our, in our house, it was kind of like my son was Pigpen, from the peanuts thing, because there was just always this cloud of craziness and dust behind him. And I would often chase that and try to clean it up before he walked out of the house or whatever. So I'm wondering if you know, there's some dust moving behind him? And you said, Have a great day. Love you. I'm going to go work on my business. How would that land with him Do you think?

Casie  26:39

A lot less a lot less shame that if something goes wrong, his mom is not sitting in a corner, crying worrying about him. And I think this is what I've learned is he's no longer the identified patient or family. First time I ever heard that. I was like, That's it. That's exactly it. And so he has freedom. And I have freedom, because we're all individual pieces, people individual standing on our own. And then if something happens, and he can reach out to get a little help by me, then I have the capacity to come and help. Because I'm pole,

Brenda  27:24

then he's got a mom who is really solid, really happy, being fed by all the great things she's doing for herself. Are there things that you've seen in the past? You know him better than anybody? Are there things that you think of that really make him feel empowered? Or make him feel confident?

Casie  27:50

Yeah, I know, I, I can tell. Or it seems like he really feels competent in the love for him when he comes in the house, and that he's not a problem anymore. And his independence like, he's amazing. He can, he's already starting to do stocks He intends on not working forever. So he's really, I just love watching him and his face light up is like, okay, so I'm doing this. And then I got this like, so he's got the competence to, at a young age to give those things a try. I never had that competence, that it, there's no way I would have been stuck. So

Brenda  28:41

that's pretty awesome. So when he tries things that are new, and when he feels secure, in your love, that makes him feel competent, that makes him feel empowered. Are there ways that you can think of in the day-to-day like let's take the next week? And kind of you know, what's going on in your life in the next week? And what's going on with him? Are there things that you think about that? You could that you think right now, I bet I could experiment? In this moment. When this happens, I'm going to try this instead, just as an experiment. This isn't like, I'm shifting my behavior. You know, sometimes we try to like eat the whole elephant at once. And that can just be really overwhelming. And so I'm wondering, what do you see as some low-hanging fruit where you're like, hey, I, I could probably shift my behavior or my words, and I just want to experiment with that this week. Is there anything that comes to mind?

Casie  29:49

Yeah, actually, it was. It's been on my mind. I do get very caught up in all the stuff that I do. And it's very easy to be completely At night to just sit and watch some TV. So to go in there when he comes in his cooking or whatever, and just be in the room and talk about the music that he's listening to, or like, Clash Royale game he's playing. Just, that's something that I have learned that I haven't done is just being present and keeping my mouth shut. You know, not not the questions. Yeah.

Brenda  30:32

So powerful. Yeah, there's, there's a shift. And it's so hard when they do turn 1819 20 that we have to shift from that parent mode to more of like a consultant mode. And how do you do that? Right? How do you start to see your child not as the one who needs to be parented? But like you said, What are you listening to? That sounds really interesting. How's that game going? You know, almost thinking of it, like somebody that you would a co-worker or a friend, you know, let's say you run into your girlfriend and her 19-year-old is there with her? What would you ask him? How school going? Or what do you want to or, you know, so does that sound like sort of a bite-size experiment that would be feasible for the next week or two?

Casie  31:31

Yeah. And I love that image that you just shared of thinking of like your your with a mom and her 19 year old, and how I would interact with that. You basically give that 19 year old power and autonomy and being a whole person. So yeah, by sitting there and not asking a million questions, and just being present. Is is, is a good thing was that when I think about it that way, that was very helpful to think of it that way? Well, that's good. That's good. It's,

Brenda  32:03

it's not easy. It is not easy. And I think the transition that you're in is an especially difficult time, because it's not like he's coming home. And he's 16. And he's re-entering high school and you still have some of those familiar guardrails. You are like, in all new territory. And so you're together, you're having to figure that out. Are those conversations that you can have with him to say, Dude, I'm figuring this out? I don't even know. Like, I don't even know what to do right now, or what to say right now. I love you. And I want to have a great relationship with you. Do you guys have those kinds of conversations?

Casie  32:52

Oh, I'm laughing because we have we do we try to have those conversations. And sometimes he's like, I don't want to talk about that. And then one time, he's like, What are you doing on your phone? And I had to confess, I said, I'm looking up topics to talk with a 19-year-old. And he goes, Man,

Brenda  33:11

I love that. But see, that's so beautiful, because then he sees you as a flawed human being, who is just like him who is trying to figure it out. You don't have all the answers in you're never gonna have all the answers. And there's something that can be really empowering about that. to, to, you know, a young adult to be like, Oh, okay, my mom's cool with like, saying, I don't have it all figured out. I really don't. But I want, I want to work on this with you. And if you want, I will tell you one that I often use with my kids, which is, it's just a mom thing. It's just you got to forgive me. I know, I've been treating you like a 10 year old. You got to forgive me. It's a mom thing. And I'm going to try to stop doing that. Because it's true in going back to that truth. If you just like rewind, rewind, rewind, forget about the 20 Minute guide and beyond addiction and the coaching and the podcast and everything that you're trying to remember and cue up the right response. To just go back to the truth of I'm just trying to figure it out. And I'm just a mom who loves you to death. And I'm probably going to get in your way. And I'm going to need you to forgive me for that. Are you cool with that? And that can just relieve like you said the shame and all of the pressure that they feel to please us because they really do want to please us. How does that sound to you? Oh,

Casie  34:56

yeah, I love that. Yes, absolutely. I am there Are you comfortable with saying the flood?

Brenda  35:02

Oh, it's very green. It's very freeing. So yeah, in the short amount of time that we've been talking, is there anything else that you're thinking? Either kind of stands out like, oh, there's this other thing that I haven't really mentioned that I probably should mention, or does this feel like, a manageable amount of information? Again, not trying to eat the whole elephant at once? To say, I feel like I've, I've gotten something tangible that I could use.

Casie  35:40

Oh, yeah, no, I definitely feel that this has been, it's been terrific. It's, it's nice for teams to be on the other side. So thank you very much. To have someone coached me through it. I really appreciate that. Yeah, no, this was extremely helpful in the path that we kind of took feels like, okay, and also knowing like, like, you kept repeating, I heard it a couple of times that, you know, just for the week, you don't have to plan like, you're doing this for the rest of your life, but just for the week, and that's a really easy bite size, just to see if I don't have to look it up in my phone of what to talk to myself. Because we're just sitting there, and it just happens.

Brenda  36:25

Yeah, yeah. And if you do have to look it up, that's okay, too, you know, that, that's fine. I think the really what I heard, and when I saw, we're on video, so those of you listening can't see us. But Casey and I are on video, and I could see your eyes really light up when you talked about your business, and what you have the plans that you have for that, and about spending time with friends and working on yourself, and, you know, going and hanging out with your husband. And so that's what excites me, because I can see that it's in there. And I can see that. Those could be really, really powerful things. And this is where, you know, sometimes we do need to write ourselves notes or have a little bit of a vision board to say, when I start feeling like I need to fix control, manage my 19 year old, who is going to make some mistakes, he's gonna drive around with the license plate hanging off his car. But when I get the urge to do that, here are the five other options that I have, which one do I want to pick right now. Because that will just immediately pull you out of that response mode of like, I gotta fix it, I gotta fix it. I can do this. And remember how intelligent he is an insightful he is. And he's obviously incredibly resourceful if he's doing, you know, engaging in the stock market at 19. So that could just be something to remember too, is, he's gonna be able to figure this out. Like this kid. He's got it. He probably did some very, we don't have time to go into it. But I'm sure he did some pretty interesting and crafty things when he was in you, you know, using before you had him go to treatment. And so yes, they might not have been the healthiest things, but he's got a lot to pull from. And he's got resourcefulness. And sometimes we forget that. And so just giving them the credit for that and saying, he's gonna figure this out. It might not look anything like what you would do, or your husband or anybody else. But if it's his play, and it works, that's beautiful. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Awesome. Well, thank you for joining me on this little bit of an experiment. I am very grateful for you to join me in a in a conversation, it can be vulnerable. So I hope that it was helpful for you, and I hope it's helpful for anybody who's listening.

Casie  39:06

Yeah, thank you for inviting me to do this. Like, I really enjoyed it. It was very helpful.

Brenda  39:14

Thank you so much for listening. If you'd like to go to the show notes, you can always find those at At Brendazane.com/podcast, each episode is listed there with a full transcript, all of the resources that we mentioned, as well as a place to leave comments if you'd like to do that. You might also want to download a free ebook I wrote called hindsight. Three things I wish I knew when my son was addicted to drugs. It's full of the information I wish I would have known when my son was struggling with his addiction. You can grab that at Brendazane.com/hindsight. Thanks again for listening and I will meet you right back here next week.